The Minimalist Educator Podcast
The Minimalist Educator Podcast
Episode 036: Elevating Education with Collective Teacher Efficacy with Dr. Lori Stollar
Unlock the secrets of Professional Learning Communities with Dr. Lori Stollar, a seasoned expert who joins us to illuminate the transformative power of PLCs in education. Shedding light on the essence of effective collaboration, Laurie dismantles the myths that have long shrouded PLCs, guiding us through the pivotal shift from a traditional teaching-centric model to a dynamic learning-centric system. In our enlightening exchange, we confront the real challenges educators face in molding a united front aimed at boosting student outcomes and discuss the game-changing effects when teachers are given the reigns to steer their professional development.
Look toward the educational horizon with us as we delve into the evolving landscape of PLCs, where breaking down silos isn't just a goal, it's a reality. Lori bestows her wisdom on the catalytic role of collective efficacy and the intrinsic value of social capital in customizing education for every learner. We equip you with strategies to keep your mission in sharp focus and to select actions that resonate with your core objectives. By the end of our discussion, you'll be inspired by the potential of PLCs to reshape not only your approach to teaching but also the very fabric of learning organizations, all while reflecting on the minimalist principles that can refine educational practices.
Lori Stollar is an educator with over 35 years of experience as a high school social studies teacher, district administrator, intermediate unit leader, and adjunct professor. In 2021, she retired from public education where she most recently served as the Director of Curriculum and Innovation. Since then Lori has consulted with schools and districts on the topics of Whole Child Education, Social Emotional Learning, and Teacher Supervision and Evaluation. She is passionate about helping teachers and school leaders positively impact student learning. Lori is the Executive Director of Pennsylvania ASCD, whose mission is to inspire educators to lead, learn, and advocate for educational impact.
Lori holds a B.S. in Education, an M.Ed. in Teaching and Curriculum, a PK-12 Principal Certification, and a Superintendent’s Letter of Eligibility. In 2014, she earned her doctorate in School Systems Leadership from Widener University. Her research interests include professional learning communities, collective efficacy, and classroom instruction.
This episode is sponsored by Pennsylvania ASCD; an organization committed to the improvement of curriculum development, supervision, instruction, promotion of professional growth, and education of children.
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Welcome to the Minimalist Educator Podcast, a podcast about pairing down to refocus on the purpose and priorities in our roles with co-hosts and co-authors of the Minimalist Teacher Book, Tammy Musiowsky-Borneman and Christine Arnold.
Speaker 2:Today we speak with Laurie about productive PLCs, or professional learning communities. She shares what is needed to create successful PLCs and her pair down pointer reminds us to take it one step at a time. Laurie Stuller is an educator with over 35 years of experience as a high school social studies teacher, district administrator, intermediate unit leaner and adjunct professor. In 2021, she retired from public education, where she most recently served as the Director of Curriculum and Innovation. Since then, laurie has consulted with schools and districts on the topics of whole child education, social-emotional learning and teacher supervision and evaluation. She is passionate about helping teachers and school leaders positively impact student learning. Laurie is the Executive Director of Pennsylvania ASCD, whose mission is to inspire educators to lead, learn and advocate for educational impact. Laurie holds a BS in Education and MED in Teaching and Curriculum, a PK-12 Principal Certification and a Superintendent's Letter of Eligibility. In 2014, she earned her Doctorate in School Systems Leadership from Widener University. Her research interests include professional learning communities, collective efficacy and classroom instruction.
Speaker 3:Welcome everyone to today's episode of the Minimalist Educator Podcast. Today we are excited to have with us Dr Laurie Stuller from Pennsylvania. Hi Laurie, welcome to the show. Hi, nice to be here. How are you today?
Speaker 4:I'm great Little chilly here in Pennsylvania today.
Speaker 3:That seems to be the trend in the Northeast. Yes, how are you, christine?
Speaker 2:I am doing well, and how are you Tummy?
Speaker 3:I'm pretty well. It's always nice to chat with amazing people on the podcast, so I'm excited to talk to Laurie today. Today we are talking about Laurie's work with PLCs, which I think can be one of those acronyms that can be really exciting for some educators here and for some kind of scary or cringy, because there's just always so much work to do in education. But PLCs is one of those things that we believe is super important to create strong cultures of learning for adults in schools. So, laurie, can you tell us because you wrote your dissertation on PLC work and then you were able to bridge that into implementation, which is a really hard thing to do so, if you can talk a little bit about your research and how you built out some of those structures in your region?
Speaker 4:Absolutely, and I think back. I'm not even sure what the original impetus was for my first attraction, but in the early 2000s PLC was getting a lot of traction. The Defors and Acre had written their PLCs at workbook in the late 90s and I saw in the early 2000s how it started to gain traction. And at that point I was working at a Pennsylvania Intermediate Unit, which is what we call our educational service agencies, and so I was working with 25 different school districts across a three county region and there was a lot of chatter about PLCs and what it was and how it could be a process or a framework to help school improvement, that continuous improvement. And Tammi, you hit the nail on the head when you said everybody can banter around the term PLCs and it means different things to different people and people implement it differently, which I think leads to some of the watering down or what Defor and Reeves referred to as PLC light, because we know that just putting a group of teachers in a meeting space and saying, well, now you're a PLC doesn't work. That's not what a true PLC is.
Speaker 4:I think that really piqued my interest and that became then the focus of my research.
Speaker 4:We had a district which became my study district, who, of course, shall remain nameless, but they were like 100% in on PLCs, probably one of the early adopters in our region, and I had the fortune of going there and I had been going there in my work through the intermediate unit to provide professional development and work with them on state initiatives, and I could see firsthand the impact of being a true professional learning community a group of individuals who are involved in those recurring cycles of inquiry that lead to continuous improvement and it's really that focus on learning.
Speaker 4:When a group comes together and they have that unyielding focus on student learning, your schools become places of learning, not places of teaching, and I could see that shift in that specific district and so having the opportunity to, and really the privilege to, dive deeply into what they were doing and to interview staff and do some surveys and collect some data really was able to fuel my research. And then, as you indicated, tammy, when I left the intermediate unit and actually went to a school district, we were able to take the the idea of a professional learning community and really take that from theory to practice in our own structure.
Speaker 2:I'd love to hear more about the role of agency within PLCs. As we've mentioned there that you know, you have some situations where you're told you're doing this PLC and then you might have a situation where it's everyone is going to do a PLC, but you can choose the area, the topic, you know the focus for your PLC, but then a lot of people just naturally engage in PLCs themselves. So what do you think the, the role of agency and ownership in the direction of these things plays?
Speaker 4:That's a great question, christine. An agency is probably that's a newer buzzword certainly, but you know, as I reflect back, and you always have those early adopters and then you always have those stragglers who you're trying to bring along. You know, if there's not ownership in what you're doing, it doesn't matter what initiative or you know I know that word gets a bad rap as well but it doesn't matter what you're trying to implement If you don't have that buy-in, that commitment from people to make it work and you provide them the resources and the information that they need to be successful, it's not going to fly. So, speaking from my experience in the district, the superintendent and I worked with a brilliant superintendent you know we really primed the pump for at least two, if not well, for two years, I guess it was, if I think back to the year start to blur together, but we really had a guiding coalition of educators that we were working with, exposing them to research, listening to what they had to say and really bringing them along and educating them as well as then educating our school board and our community. Because there does have to be that commitment to what you're doing and in the case of the district from which I retired, we totally restructured the school day. Now you want to talk about disrupting lives in a community and for educators themselves.
Speaker 4:If you're going to change the start and the end time of the school day, you need to have that buy-in and that agency, that ownership, to make it happen. So I think that without that deep desire of people to do it and to know why they're doing it, you know we're not doing it because, well, that's the latest buzzword and we've all been there in education. You know you have those educators who say, yeah, new superintendent, new director, curriculum, we'll just wait them out because they'll eventually leave and this will all go away. You know DeFore and Iker wrote their book. It's been 25 years. That term is still very well known, very widely respected, and there's now research and hundreds of schools who have been labeled as model schools.
Speaker 4:Who can, you know, really attest to the power of having these learning organizations focused on learning and helping students achieve all students achieve and what that really means. So I probably strayed away from your initial question, christine, but yes, I think it's ownership really, and but providing the resources. If teachers don't know what they're supposed to do in that time, then, left to their own devices. They'll be planning field trips and talking about the discipline problems that they're having. So how do you, how do you provide a structure for them? How do you provide the resources and the supports, and how do you provide the resources and the supports that they need to be successful so that they can really focus on student learning, which involves adult learning? We, as the adults, have to be the continuous learner as well. We can't do 35 years in education and do the first year 35 times.
Speaker 3:You kind of stole the question right out of my mind, laurie, because you were talking about you know. You have to provide some kind of structure, because then your PLC, you know, goes wayward. So providing that kind of you know agency can be scary for teachers, right, because sometimes it is very open, like you just need to take ownership of like whatever it is you're learning and la la la. But that's really hard, especially, you know, on the teacher's end, and then we want them to do it, you know, within their classroom with their students. So if they're not experiencing it, then it's probably not going to happen in their classrooms Maybe.
Speaker 3:I mean, I don't want to over generalize, but what kind of structures have you provided in your work that can give a sense of comfort to people working in their PLCs but also like eventually it's like okay, they'll be on their way and they can get working? Because it is a bit like nebulous, I guess, where you're just kind of openly discovering what you need to learn to improve as a teacher or like whatever the learning cycle is or the inquiry is. Yeah, and that's a bit scary as a teacher too, because sometimes we just want to be told what to do.
Speaker 4:Absolutely right. I know there are times we just want to be left alone, right? Yes, in a professional learning community it's built on that collaboration, that interdependency and the fact that together, alone I'm smart, but together we're brilliant.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 4:But the structure is Tammy. I think time is number one. Teachers must be provided the time to be able to meet and meet deeply it. You know, 20 minutes once a week isn't going to be the kind of time they need. And you know, we all know the research and it talks about how much time teachers in the United States spend in front of students, versus other places like, you know, singapore or Japan, or where teachers are spending time collaborating and working together.
Speaker 4:So I indicated before that when we implemented PLCs in the district in which I worked, we totally changed the school day. So time is the first thing you must be able to provide and you have to be willing to do whatever it takes to provide that time, whether that's restructuring the school day, like we did, or hiring substitutes which is even more difficult now and in the era that we're living in or having a kind of culture where people are able to and willing to, you know, rotate in and cover, if you will, for one another. Whatever it is, you have to find time, time. Time is like the number one structure that you have to put in place Resources. So, again, speaking from experience, we learn best when we're all together, but we need the information and the knowledge and the know-how. So often, you know, obviously things are. You can find anything on the internet today and you know, good or bad, and there's a you know, certainly a wealth of information there. But when you talk about the questions of a PLC, you know the first question in a PLC is what do we want students to know and be able to do? And that parkens back to having that guaranteed and viable curriculum. In the words of Marzano, it talks about curriculum design, being able to unpack the standards. That's a lot of time and effort in itself If you think about what it takes to create that guaranteed and viable curriculum so we can identify what it is we want students to know and be able to do.
Speaker 4:There's multiple pieces there. So in that example, being able to provide instructional coaches for the teachers we had a great wealth of instructional coaches, especially on the ELA side. Little more difficult even to find them in the math side. But the coaches that we had the reading specialists and whatnot were able to. They had the time. We were able to give them time where they were able to prioritize some of that curriculum, unpack the standards and then become part of those learning community times and share some of that information with the teachers. So that's an example of a human resource that we could provide to the teachers, giving them the support of an instructional coach, which again is a privilege. You're not always in a situation to be able to do that, but money will spend.
Speaker 4:And again, you can't just throw people in a space and say go me, be successful, go, change the world. You need time for that group to work together and to establish a shared mission, vision. Those beliefs, the trust, the trust, the respect is so important there. So creating time and structures to allow them to become a cohesive group. And then, of course, strategic leadership. So, and how you balance that? What's the tight loose? You talk about that tighter loose coupling. As the director of curriculum, I was able to go and be part of those meetings. But how do you do that and not be seen as, oh, I'm here to check up on you or you know this isn't a gotcha moment how am I here to support you? What can I contribute to that group meeting? Strategic leadership, providing those supports, those times, is another critical, critical piece, I think, in the success of a professional learning community.
Speaker 2:And do you say the PLCs have been around for 20 years or more. I'm wondering what significant changes you've seen with PLCs over that time and also where do you think it's going in the future. What do you see the future of PLCs to be?
Speaker 4:Hmm, successes and where I see it going. That's an interesting. That's going to make me think, christine. Again, I truly believe in the power of PLCs. If I didn't, I wouldn't have spent several years researching and delving into the research and then, of course, going to a district and implementing it, because I saw power in there.
Speaker 4:When teachers work together, you know the collective efficacy, the belief that they can. When they start to see success, you know, then you get to that tipping point and I think they become even more motivated. But that social capital, what we learn by being a group and I read an article, you know, years ago which I think really stuck with me and I now it's dated, it's 12 years old but I still cite it and it talked about the missing link in school reform is social capital, what teachers learn from one another when they're together. And that's to me what a PLC is, and it's just as much, if not more so, maybe, about the adult learning than it is about the student learning and being able to, for teachers to be willing to be vulnerable. And because you really are exposing yourself, you know, if you would have said to me, you know, 35 years ago, when I was a brand new teacher and we probably all have these moments where we think back and go like, oh, I was horrible, like I wouldn't have wanted my data shared with the people next door to me, which really talked about those silos and that that closed community we had as educators. So I think you know creating the conditions where you're willing to be vulnerable and put yourself out there and realize it's not about you but it's about the student learning. How do we, how do we create the environment where we're looking at data we're not talking about Lori or Tammy or Christine and how do we create the conditions for that to happen?
Speaker 4:So I think I've seen more of the breaking down of those silos in education. I think that some of it comes from the idea of professional learning communities being learning organizations where we can truly impact change. As far as the future, I would only hope that it continues to to grow and evolve and morph, because we know that. You know, plc is at work. When you look at questions three and four, which are about what do we do when students don't learn it and what do we do when they already know it really lends itself to intervention and enrichment. To me, that's the differentiation, the personalization that we want to see education moving towards, so that each child has a chance to to be successful, to maximize their own potential, whatever that may be. So I would hope that that the structure of a professional learning community or a learning organization would help lead to more student success.
Speaker 3:That's a perfect segue into how we wrap up our show. We always ask our guests for a pair down pointer, and I feel like kind of thinking futuristically about PLCs and the direction that they can potentially go, because I think you're right, lori, like I think that teachers have really kind of you know, silos are coming down and it's kind of fun to learn together, right Like we're social beings, we need to interact with each other, we want to talk to each other, we want to learn from each other, and once we build that trust with each other, it becomes much easier to be able to do that work together. So you've given us lots of nuggets to think about, so we want you to now pick out one of those or a different pair down pointer that you would want to share with our listeners.
Speaker 4:I think it's very old cliche, but you know, it's just, it's one step at a time. As far as the PLC it can be, anything you do is overwhelming. So I think you have to really distill it down to you know what is my priority, what is my goal, why am I doing this? And then what do I need to put in place to be successful? And how do you keep out the rest of the noise?
Speaker 4:I mean, you can relate that to email, I think technology, email, social media you know it can just distract us and pull us away from our true focus and where we need to be. So I would say, to really drill down to what is my purpose, why am I doing this? And then what do I need to get there and try and block out the others, and if the rest of what's coming at you isn't related tightly to where you're going, give yourself permission to say, no, we're not going to do that, we're not going to put something else on the plate because there's only so much room on the plate. So we have to pick and choose those items which we know will get us where we need to be and let the rest of it fall away.
Speaker 3:That's awesome. Thank you so much, Laurie. Thank you for being with us today. Well you're most welcome.
Speaker 4:I actually enjoyed resurrecting some of my research and reminding myself of my journey, and you know the power of what I saw happen in my district, so thank you.
Speaker 2:Today's episode was brought to you by Pennsylvania ASCD. Pennsylvania ASCD is an organization committed to the improvement of curriculum development, supervision, instruction, promotion of professional growth and education of children. As a state affiliate of ASCD, our organization promotes quality leadership by providing timely programs and services to our membership. Pennsylvania ASCD is the proud recipient of the 2011 ASCD Affiliate Excellence Award.
Speaker 1:Be sure to join Tammy and Christine and guests for more episodes of the Minimalist Educator Podcast. They would love to hear about your journey with minimalism. Connect with them at PlanZPLS on Twitter or Instagram. The music for the podcast has been written and performed by Gaia Moretti.
